Console & handheld debate

[NekoJonez]

Okay, I can agree somewhat with that.
But at the other hand... Sometimes it's not such a good idea to put EVERY EVERYTHING in a game... A game can be fun when it has flaws to discover... Perfect doesn't exist after all...

Yes I agree, I just mean in general its usually better to have more horsepower, so devs can create the game they want to.

And what I am saying to that ...

More horsepower = / = better console.

It's the software that matters. At least to me.

[O:\msg]

But better hardware allows the devs to do more with that software
I can see we're not going to agree on this lol.

Hmmmm..... how about Xenoblade Chronicles for an example? The best game on the Wii, but imagine if they had PS3 hardware, HD graphics and 10x the disc storage space to work with.
Nintendo make great games already that almost keep up with the competition on poor hardware, so I would love to see them do something on a top spec machine.

[NekoJonez]

But better hardware allows the devs to do more with that software
I can see we're not going to agree on this lol.

Hmmmm..... how about Xenoblade Chronicles for an example? The best game on the Wii, but imagine if they had PS3 hardware, HD graphics and 10x the disc storage space to work with.
Nintendo make great games already that almost keep up with the competition on poor hardware, so I would love to see them do something on a top spec machine.

Different opinions are good...

But let's approach this from a different direction.... I have to mention just one game to get my point across... Minecraft. A widely popular game with not the "top notch" design out there... It's 8/16 bit-ish.. (depends on your texture pack) And still it's highly addictive and fun. I am somewhat sure that a trimmed down version could run on older consoles.

There are many games that use old technologies and become also popular... Minecraft, VVVVVV (I hope I have enough V's.) ... Heck, there are homebrewers that still create games for older systems like the NES.

Okay, you can do more with your game but horsepower... Meh, having creative restrictions can be interesting as well... Why...? It is a challenge to see what you can come up with to some what realize the idea... And maybe that way you can maybe even create a whole new gameplay mechanic.

In addition to that... Personally I think that the developers are trying to sell their game because it's "nicer looking" and "bigger then ever before." But... does that make a console better...? In the exact definition of better... yes... since it's in improvement over the old one., personal taste... no... My personal favorite handheld is and stays my DS.  It's with how creative you work within the given boundaries. Because as a writer I can say it without a doubt... Having total creative freedom and being able to do THE best of the industry can quickly make you OVERCONFIDENT of your game and when it lacks... you can go thinking... Meh, the graphics will pull customers in....

Think about it... When you see an ad for a game on TV .... How often do you look at how the game looks... instead of the gameplay... I see my friends do that an awful lot... And to my opinion that is just wrong. The gameplay is what matters... Gaming is a hobby... a time waster... If I want to go see a movie, I put a movie in. Okay, nice graphics can enhance a game to get more involved BUT does that mean that everything needs to look very realistic...? I don't think so.

[O:\msg]

I don't go for graphics myself, I can see what you mean there and it's a shame that (it tends to be young kids) some people are all for graphics, gameplay is first and foremost for all intelligent/experienced gamers. My friends son won't even pick up the controller when we put Sega megadrive collection on the PS3, he says "I'm not playing that!! Look at it, its crap!!" lol, Streets of Rage is awesome fun.
BUT, better hardware allows gameplay advances too, like the 3D I mentioned earlier.

[NekoJonez]

BUT, better hardware allows gameplay advances too, like the 3D I mentioned earlier.

Agreed. You actually remind me on an interesting point too... Emulation... Take the PSP for example... I have friends who use it as a portable emulator for SNES, NES, GBA and what not... But then I ask myself the question... Does that make the PSP a better handheld or the SNES, NES, GBA a better console since it's still emulated and searched for...?

[BloodcatNS]

Okay, nice graphics can enhance a game to get more involved BUT does that mean that everything needs to look very realistic...? I don't think so.

Unless you want a cartooned kiddie version of CoD (Which would be very interesting), or an Uncharted game where everyone becomes a Doughnut Drake version of themselves, then yes, it has to stick to it's artwork.

[NekoJonez]

Okay, nice graphics can enhance a game to get more involved BUT does that mean that everything needs to look very realistic...? I don't think so.

Unless you want a cartooned kiddie version of CoD (Which would be very interesting), or an Uncharted game where everyone becomes a Doughnut Drake version of themselves, then yes, it has to stick to it's artwork.

Heck yes. And that doesn't need to be the best graphics on the market. If you can set the tone you are setting with music and story... Then it's all good. Like I said in another debate... A game needs to form one nice package... Where one element doesn't ruin the tone of the rest. And if that is with outdated graphics... Fine by me.

[Swagmaster]

With "weak gameplay" I mean that the recent games do nothing really new but rather perfect existing formula's. Each Call Of Duty is just another setting but the same basic routine. As far as I know and have heard... What is the last innovation that COD did in their series itself?

What was the last one Mario did? The only thing they change is making Mario sports games and the quality of those are declining with each new game

And Zelda barely ever changes anything. Same game except for the new adventuring style

Call of Duty has changes just as big as Mario and Zelda too. They introduced zombies in game 5, introduced spec ops in game 6, revamped zombies 100x better in game 7 and then introduced survival in game 8. PLUS the online experience improves with each game. On top of that, Modern Warfare has one of the greatest stories I've seen in a shooter.

[NekoJonez]

And Zelda barely ever changes anything. Same game except for the new adventuring style

Really now...? Let's see if your argument holds water....

Examples:

• Running in Skyward Sword.
• 2 worlds system in Link to the past (used in other titles too.)
• Wind Waker & Phantom Hourglass brought us exploring with a boat.

The core doesn't change ... I agree with that but ... If you compare each COD side by side... It's almost always the same kind of thing... But in Zelda... I don't think so... Different number of dungeon's... Different enemies and final bosses... Sometimes you have even a train to ride instead of a horse...

So, sorry I disagree.

[BloodcatNS]

On top of that, Modern Warfare has one of the greatest stories I've seen in a shooter.

No. Just... no.

[Kiss x Miz]

On top of that, Modern Warfare has one of the greatest stories I've seen in a shooter.

No. Just... no.

Yeah. It was a great story, that doesn't take away the fact the multiplayer sucks.
I'm glad the campaign was this good or I would've asked my money back.
I admit the game is really bad... That doesn't make everything about it suck though.

Anyway, handhelds are still shitty

[Mr.PowPow]

On top of that, Modern Warfare has one of the greatest stories I've seen in a shooter.

TimeSplitters
Resistance 1,2 and 3
Resident Evil (all of them)
BioShock
Borderlands
DeadSpace
F.E.A.R
Metro 2033
Goldeneye
System Shock 2
Half Life 2
Killzone 3
S.T.A.L.K.E.R

All of these games had stories that urinate on the story of Modern Warfare.

[Kiss x Miz]

On top of that, Modern Warfare has one of the greatest stories I've seen in a shooter.

TimeSplitters
Resistance 1,2 and 3
Resident Evil (all of them)
BioShock
Borderlands
DeadSpace
F.E.A.R
Metro 2033
Goldeneye
System Shock 2
Half Life 2
Killzone 3
S.T.A.L.K.E.R

All of these games had stories that urinate on the story of Modern Warfare.

Where's you contribution to this debate? o.O spammer!

Btw hating on a franchise because it generally gets bad reviews is pathetic.
the campaign is far more binding than what I've seen from the games you've just listed.

I don't see the point in handhelds... The screen is too tiny and they're too exhausting to play on.
Better get a console if you just want to play a game.

[Mr.PowPow]

Where's you contribution to this debate? o.O spammer!

Btw hating on a franchise because it generally gets bad reviews is pathetic.
the campaign is far more binding than what I've seen from the games you've just listed.

I don't really read reviews to be honest, I played the Modern warfare games and just generally thought it was a soulless bunch of turd. It was so bad, that I didn't even buy it, my friend bought it in a second hand shop for like 7 pounds and regretted it so much he asked me to take it off him (sounds exaggerated, but funny enough its true ).
Modern Warfare (and in fact, all of the COD games) are so mindnumbingly boring, with little to no depth or story development, that I would only play for the graphics and shooting action. Its got good gameplay, I'll give it that, but story? Bah, comedy.

All the games listed above are vaguely more interesting to play. Not saying they are awesome, but they are somewhat more gripping in the story aspect.



Nowwwwwww in terms of the actual debate, like I have said before. I simply wouldn't play a DS inside the house, because handhelds are for outside and consoles are for inside, consoles cannot move thus they stay inside, handhelds can, thus they go outside. Its only logic.

[Swagmaster]

Let me just ask. How many people on Earth (~7 billion) would buy a DS if a PS3 or 360 (and all their graphics and capabilities) can be taken on the road and bought for ~100$

[BloodcatNS]

Let me just ask. How many people on Earth (~7 billion) would buy a DS if a PS3 or 360 (and all their graphics and capabilities) can be taken on the road and bought for ~100$

None, of course. If that's the case, then they would become handhelds and any previous handheld would be obsolete. I don't see your point. You just turned a powerful console to a portable and made the price cheaper than any other handheld.

[NekoJonez]

I don't see the point in handhelds... The screen is too tiny and they're too exhausting to play on.
Better get a console if you just want to play a game.

One word: PORTABLE.

[O:\msg]

I'd rather take my laptop if I really had to play games outside, emulators even do PS2 games, the choice of games is huge. I actually bought a car charger for it and I have an internet dongle so I drive all over Europe playing games and internetting on it

[Swagmaster]

Let me just ask. How many people on Earth (~7 billion) would buy a DS if a PS3 or 360 (and all their graphics and capabilities) can be taken on the road and bought for ~100$

None, of course. If that's the case, then they would become handhelds and any previous handheld would be obsolete. I don't see your point. You just turned a powerful console to a portable and made the price cheaper than any other handheld.

(DS im America is $100 and DSi is $120)

What I'm saying is people buy the handhelds because they are cheap and portable. NOT because they are better than (or even compatible to) consoles

[NekoJonez]

Let me just ask. How many people on Earth (~7 billion) would buy a DS if a PS3 or 360 (and all their graphics and capabilities) can be taken on the road and bought for ~100$

None, of course. If that's the case, then they would become handhelds and any previous handheld would be obsolete. I don't see your point. You just turned a powerful console to a portable and made the price cheaper than any other handheld.

(DS im America is $100 and DSi is $120)

What I'm saying is people buy the handhelds because they are cheap and portable. NOT because they are better than (or even compatible to) consoles

But then again... What's the use of comparing a console with a handheld..? Isn't that like comparing a car with a bike?

I am a handheld fan. Mostly because I think that RPG's work better on handhelds then on consoles. Why? Well, let me explain myself.

You are closer to the screen so you can enjoy the text better. Also, you can grind easier since you can take the game everywhere with you.

That are some reasons why I personally think RPG's work better on handhelds. But the biggest issue here that has been pointed out by MSG & me.. what is "the best"...? Is it the console / handheld with the most advanced hardware... or is it the console where the given hardware is the best used by the studio's?

[O:\msg]

I hit on the RPG thingy earlier:

JRPG's are a good example of older been better, this gen has been particularly bad, its all about HD though, to have a huge non linear JRPG in HD is too expensive and would take too long.

That's why handheld JRPG's have been better this gen I think.